Game of Thrones - How to Ruin a Great Show

20 Th05, 2019
4 594 309 lượt xem

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  • I stopped watching the moment Arya failed to kill Ed Sheeren..

    Sean CurranSean Curran9 phút trước
  • I honestly hated how Sansa was the shittiest character in the show... (un popular opinion here) but I just felt she just became an "edgy bitch" after what Ramsay did to her. Of course it was horrifying and bad, but the fact that "she's just so angry and sad because she was raped" don't make her a "cool" or "capable" character. Is more, I feel she became like some sort of mix between Cersei, Littlefinger and Ramsay after that, but without the cool parts of those characters. She's more useless than ever, like she always depends on others and can't do shit by herself... She didn’t' "became strong", she's just like a "walking plot device". She's just there existing and giving orders just because and that's all... My biggest disappoint with her is that the writers waste a huge opportunity with her, I actually believe she will at least stab one white walker with that obsidian dagger she had, but hope... Useless, dumb and a complete waste of anything... And the fact that she had to depend in the person that ruined her life shows how fucked up she became... Sorry but she playing same game as Littlefinger wasn't "cool" or "Hardcore", it was fucking depressing... And yeah I know if she didn't do that she and more people will die, but I still think is fucked up and plain wrong. More because of the way she behaved towards Jon and the rest, like... She just lost her soul or something... I actually liked her more when she was a sheltered spoiler innocent little girl... Oh and her fanboys good grief, they are the dumbest people alive, because they actually believed that if you hate Sansa you "hate women" (believe me twitter is a really toxic place). If you like the character is okey, but God... These people were absolutely butt hurt over a bunch of people not worshipping their favorite character, so pathetic...

    TheCJTheCJ46 phút trước
  • Tyrion earlier season: I'm not questioning your honor. I'm denying it's existence. Tyrion season 8: Varys has no cock!

    J PJ PGiờ trước
  • Danny’s story got infected by contemporary politics

    misirloupowerslidemisirloupowerslideGiờ trước
  • D&D should be given the shame walk

    Ruturaj JadhavRuturaj JadhavGiờ trước
  • Whatever.

    Evan AbbottEvan AbbottGiờ trước
  • It's cute that you think GRRM delayed the books to avoid competing with the show. I think he hasn't released any new books in 8 years because he wrote himself into a tangled web of bloated nonsense with Dance with Dragons. The first few books were concise, focused and brilliant. Gradually he kept expanding the character list, the geographical locations, the plotlines, etc. He's juggling too many plates now and is probably more interested in living his life and enjoying his success than ironing out the story in a way that satisfies all the fans whose expectations have risen to comically high levels. Add the complications of the hyper sensitive political climate that's target him and his work more than a few times and I don't envy his position at all. At this point I could care less about the series.

    Franklin S.Franklin S.2 giờ trước
  • It was already shite as soon as they killed off Sharpe and the bloke from Bodyguard took the mantle

    DudeDude3 giờ trước
  • watching this in 2021 and still hate that stupid show runners

    Stanislav MykhalchukStanislav Mykhalchuk4 giờ trước
  • You're right about everything and I hate that this is the truth. I'm still living in denial. Game of Thrones is the best thing that ever happened to me and I don't wanna admit the last season was shit.

    Lurre 10Lurre 107 giờ trước
  • I'm glad I never got into it.

    Henry the PaleoGuyHenry the PaleoGuy9 giờ trước
  • I think Sansa also had a complete story arc.

    DGot14UDGot14U13 giờ trước
  • Would you kindly suggest a better ending to satisfy us? With so much invested, no man is capable.

    BilalBilal14 giờ trước
  • Can`t wait to see one of these for "Attack On Titan"

    Ibrahim TamemeIbrahim Tameme15 giờ trước
  • Thank you for pointing out Daenerys burning the Tarleys was a hint she was going mad. I am not a huge Dany fan myself, however, as you said, it is how all punishments are handed out in that era when a leader executes people who betray or disobey.

    Monica KellyMonica Kelly15 giờ trước
  • If you think the ending of the series ruined it, you weren't paying enough attention . . .it ended how it needed to and how it was intended to. . .

    Jim CJim C16 giờ trước
  • im still angry about this, it was my most favourite show ever and they ruined it all, now i just try to forget it even happened

    Problematic BitchProblematic Bitch20 giờ trước
  • him losing his sword hand haha thats funny

    Mr AzMr Az21 giờ trước
  • The blatant ideological hypocrisy of the main characters is retarded. It's considered acceptable to starve people to the point of cannibalism, skin them alive, behead them, or burn them with wildfire. But gods forbid you kill them with dragonfire, or foreign armies. Dany got screwed big time.

    pete perkinspete perkins23 giờ trước
  • I inderstood your analysis sucks when you said "funny guy" when you were talking about Euron 🤔

    Berkay GulBerkay Gul23 giờ trước
  • we all know where Daenerys is on this scalar. viworld.info/rock/video/k32ol6zYtZOAsWQ.html Unfortunately, the scalar is always right ^^

    Ati1mAti1mNgày trước
  • You should watch Attack on Titan bro

    Ashwini Raj MouryaAshwini Raj MouryaNgày trước
  • Unfortunately, you have to say that almost all series or manga and anime have a bad or disappointing ending. Getting a good ending is by far the hardest part of a very long story that is told. But that is not the case here. Besides, they couldn't. From season 5 you have already seen that they cannot deliver really good quality without being under time pressure. That's the difference between a story writer who only writes for money or someone who writes it out of conviction and love for the story like George R. R. Martin.

    Ati1mAti1mNgày trước
  • I agree with the most things you said but that hodor plot was amazing

    Guilty PleasureGuilty PleasureNgày trước
  • Almost feels like Lucasfilm was put in charge of the last season. XD

    MezconMezconNgày trước
  • The amount of times Dany said she wanted to protect the innocents, not be a tyrant and prove she can be righteous I will forever refuse to believe she would slaughter an entire cities population.

    Vinnie GVinnie GNgày trước
  • i genuinely thought bran would warg into a dragon or the night king at some point to end the long night battle or the last war. no words could sum up the disappointment that season 7 and 8 were.

    Ashmita SahaAshmita SahaNgày trước
  • I can agree with everything you say and still hate the fucking vocal fry you practice...it's fucking annoying as all hell dude...just stop doing it

    SavageHippieSavageHippieNgày trước
  • 12:59 where is this "...ok" guy from?? so familiar.

    jbuggjbuggNgày trước
  • do nothing season 3 to 5 in Meereen then rush 25 dumb plots in 10 episodes

    Schrodingers HatSchrodingers HatNgày trước
  • Stannis was hated because he kill his only child and daughter to further his ambition.

    Predator KingPredator KingNgày trước
  • here is my go at the ending ha so end of season 7 the nights watch are at the wall they see the army of the dead marching so they send ravens an bran has a look through the crows an confirms it so Danny an john gets word so Danny fly's her dragons she sees the army of the dead an then the night king appears brings on a storm so she cant see. one of the giants with a bow takes out one of the dragons it falls but not in the water but by the wall she gets out of there with the other two dragons night king wakes him an he knocks down the wall end of season.so no need of all this shit going to get a white an pulling chains out there holes .and season eight cersi is the one to go mad an blows up everything with wild fire because she sees Danny with her dragon but euron did not kill one he just got hurt in the fight in the long night episodes which i would have made two episodes so the dragon is resting an healing. so Danny don't get the throne it gets destroyed in the wild fire. there is scorpions in Winterfell they take out 3 giants an the night king dragon which the writers forgot about the other two giants too hahaha cersi gets killed by aria with a face that she puts on that cersi is close too. euron an Jamie kill each other. grey grey worm dies by taking out a white walker misandi lives. all or main people take out white walkers with amazing fight scenes an some die trying teon takes out a white too an dies after. john an aria fight the night king in the next episode an john gets hurt an aria trys to kill him but he seriously hurts her she throws john the dagger an he trys to kill the night king bran is in a vison while all this is happen an he discovers he wants Sam an gillies baby because the baby is next in line to become the next night king or white walker so night king leaves with the child. everybody takes turns to be king bran included even john gets a turn every so many years.

    34powerman34powermanNgày trước
  • The Set up is still some of the best writing in TV so that shouldn’t go unnoticed. But Yh the ending sucked

    Ihtisham HussainIhtisham HussainNgày trước
  • CRAZY TAXI

    UpperGroundUpperGroundNgày trước
  • Talk about the white horse in the last episode

    Angie daniAngie daniNgày trước
  • The character they butchered the most was Varys, what they did to him should have landed them jail time. Peter Belish and Varys are the catalysts of the entire story. I can SOMEWHAT understand Belish's end but Varys who outsmarts everyone he comes across meets his end because he forgot to send a letter or some shit.

    Tom McTom McNgày trước
  • Dude, you basically communicated everything I felt. All the way down to Jaime being the best character and having the most complex story, to hating what Arya had become.

    Tony CarneyTony CarneyNgày trước
  • Really overrated show

    TMTK 1348TMTK 1348Ngày trước
  • I got bored like 10minutes into this video.. i think the last seasons were rushed and very disappointing.. but you get over it because it's just a show.

    NizarNizarNgày trước
  • Agree with everything except the "Brienne was fine"... if you love Jaime as a character and have watched the same show (and bonus if you have read the books) you know that Jaime's and Brienne's fates are deeply connected. Brienne was the catalyst, the one that made Jaime want to change. Yes, I recognise that deep down Jaime always had honour but Brienne made him want to do good things, the right things. So, in my opinion, by ruining Jaime's character by making him evil and irreparable you are indirectly ruining Brienne, because she, an honourable woman, was too dumb and got fooled by him

    Phoebe SPhoebe S2 ngày trước
  • I very much agree - was a great fan until this last last season. Then D&D killed everything, every main character and the whole plot. A great epic story turning into a stupid comic book. Worst ending I ever saw. Why I quit HBO.

    Jesper GimbelJesper Gimbel2 ngày trước
  • what if he dies before publishing the book ...

    H R I T T I KH R I T T I K2 ngày trước
  • The most on point analysis even in 2021

    Ariel HattenAriel Hatten2 ngày trước
  • elmos dad should not let elmo watch GOT also this show ended the same way gossip girl and pretty little liars ended. shit because when you keep yell winter is coming or who is the gossip girl the payoff is never good

    knight mehknight meh2 ngày trước
  • Once Dany became the villain I knew season 8 went to shit

    VibesByLuxuryVibesByLuxury2 ngày trước
  • Great analysis of crap character arcs in GoT. One push back: Cersei as Lex Luther instead of Cersei subtle was not out of left field. From scene 1, she was a vain thing that cared only about her three kids. Eventually all three kids are dead, two poisoned and one suicide, father would force her to marry a gay man, then she does the naked walk of shame in shit. With no father or Jaime to restrain her, of course she goes Lex. The entire series builds to blowing the Cept, unlike the other character arcs.

    Mark HeslepMark Heslep2 ngày trước
  • I hate calling Dan and Dave D&D out of respect for Dungeons and Dragons...but I really hope he's writing both WOW and ADOS at the same time and that's why its taking so long. They're is the most anticipated books of our time. FINISH THEM!

    DarkLight6TvDarkLight6Tv2 ngày trước
  • D&D should feel great shame, I tell ya hwat

    ClockworkMansionClockworkMansion2 ngày trước
  • So yes. The story arcs are a bit baffling but remember it’s just a tv show set in a fantasy universe with grumpkins and snarks soooo.....

    Loot LeoLoot Leo2 ngày trước
  • release the george cut

    n nn n2 ngày trước
  • It’s simple to understand why the show sucked so much ass. The more the show deviated from the books, the worse it got-and it got real fucking bad. The writers of the show are absolute trash. Practically everything they did that wasn’t a direct copy-and-paste from the books was dogshit.

    Jaded Old JoeJaded Old Joe3 ngày trước
  • When you're feeling down When you've screwed up When you've lost all respect from your peers When you've lost all honor Remember, it's not so bad! Game of Thrones had an 8th season.

    Showcase MeShowcase Me3 ngày trước
  • Jon Snow: "that dragon pussy got me acting strange"

    MoJungleMoJungle3 ngày trước
  • Happy 10th Year Anniversary GOT🎂

    Last90's DudeLast90's Dude3 ngày trước
  • Martin should have taken advice from Jim Butcher. Butcher sat down and wrote a plot baseline in college and now we have 17 Dresden files books and more coming.

    Bole PerishonBole Perishon3 ngày trước
  • 100% agree with pretty much everything you said. Incredible analysis!

    Josh LevinsonJosh Levinson3 ngày trước
  • I agree with a lot of this. And disagree with some too. But my boy Sandor had the absolute best arch on the show. My favorite character hands down. Besides Jamie who had the potential for the best arch until he peaced out on Brienne, then threw all of his well deserved compassion away, and died to 15 bricks on his legs.

    Jay WjrJay Wjr3 ngày trước
  • Forgetting your own plot story is a great way to ruin a franchise

    Paperfilia CollectiblesPaperfilia Collectibles3 ngày trước
  • Another example for me is the horrible writing they did with the Stark girls. Arya was a fan of the Targaryen sisters, the dark sister sward and the dragons and then Daenerys came to Winterfell to help them with two amazing dragons and Arya is just like: I dont like you because reasons. And Sansa!..urgh! dont get me start with Sansa. I was rooting for both Stark sisters i really liked them.

    luibrosluibros3 ngày trước
  • Why would people compare this to Lost when they could compare it to Dexter and... be right?

    Steve CheneySteve Cheney3 ngày trước
  • John Snow was the biggest missed opportunity in the series

    Lazy IslanderLazy Islander3 ngày trước
  • I hope those idiots D&D never work again.

    Elijah ElvisElijah Elvis3 ngày trước
  • The battle against the Night King should of been the ending of the show and everyone should of died The shows tag line since forever has been "Winter is Coming" and the white walkers are basically that Winter and of how cool would it of been for the show to start off with them and end with them

    fairyamyfairyamy3 ngày trước
    • Why are you commenting just now? Are you a new GoT watcher?

      LilfalfsLilfalfs2 ngày trước
    • Also, i dont like how danny lost her other deagon, like when she lost one to the Night King it was shocking, these dragons have been built up since the end of s1 as powerful and huge and the strongest things to ever of lived and the Night King killing one and then converting it really got peoples attention and to look at him and go "oh no, this dude is really bad" and get hyped up for the battle against him The loss of the first dragon was an event, it was scary The second dragon being shot down is literally where i stopped watching, i got up out of my seat, said it was bullshit and went to my room

      fairyamyfairyamy3 ngày trước
  • I really dont like how Jon basically being immortal is never touched upon

    fairyamyfairyamy3 ngày trước
    • Like after he was bought back there were at least 2 scenes where he should of died (the crush in botb and when he fell into the ice as everyone was escaping the white walkers on the dragon)

      fairyamyfairyamy3 ngày trước
  • I don’t know, to have the proper ending you are suggesting would of taken another 8 years probably...no thanks I’ll take the ending and final season we were given. The show needed to end and someone had to do it. Let’s face it GRRM has failed to finish this and probably never will.

    2bad mice2bad mice3 ngày trước
  • You spoiled Lost for me...

    Lauriane LeclercqLauriane Leclercq4 ngày trước
  • Its like JJ Abrams, great beginning, shitty ending

    Dmitry KimDmitry Kim4 ngày trước
  • Dragons aren’t rare They were gone for over 150+ years

    N A XN A X4 ngày trước
  • omg attack on titan finale checked every box

    red winered wine4 ngày trước
  • Great video!

    ravens5858ravens58584 ngày trước
  • I never saw this show but I just wanted to see why everyone say this season ruined the show as a whole. Should I watch game of thrones?

    Christian TookFlightChristian TookFlight4 ngày trước
  • How to ruin a great show? Hire D&D.

    BlackFyreBlackFyre5 ngày trước
  • One big problem. These books/show aren't fantasy. Not even close. This is political intrigue with fantasy tropes.

    WatjalukinatWatjalukinat5 ngày trước
  • 31:44 I know it's a small detail to nit-pick, too, but if Jon is a Targaryen, then the fire wouldn't kill him. He's not "full-blood" because for once it wasn't incest, but they could have melted the rock and then shown that he survived because it's in his blood. Would've at least done SOMETHING with the reveal.

    Rory GiambalvoRory Giambalvo5 ngày trước
  • D&D? More like Dumb and Dorker.

    ShreemShreem5 ngày trước
  • View talking thrones

    AbhishekAbhishek5 ngày trước
  • I was desperately hoping tyrion was betraying danny. it was the only way to justify how useless he was being, and also the only way to balance out the power dynamic. and if he felt danny was truly not fit to lead it would have made sense.

    ASMR IsahASMR Isah5 ngày trước
  • Not to mention that the white walkers couldn't cross the wall because of the spells but suddenly they could. Also, the night king didn't want to come south for 8000 years. What is his motivation for doing so now?

    Carlos NunezCarlos Nunez5 ngày trước
  • OUTSTANDING!!!!! d&d let down HBO, the characters, and the fans!! I'm definitely going back and rereading the books....

    CircleB1097CircleB10975 ngày trước
  • Two years later and Winds of Winter is no where to be seen

    Cameron WhiteCameron White5 ngày trước
  • I never cared much about the series, I had started with the books and preferred them over the series. What I loved about the story "A Song of Ice and Fire" was precisely what the series gave up on: character development. I just loved how the heroic Daenerys was slowly foreshadowed to becoming a darker character (which in the books, yes she is) even though her boring parts were what made me stop reading eventually; how Bran and Arya were developing their talents and slowly garnering the power to change the fate of their entire continent and carry on the legacy of their family as a force to be reckoned with; how Jon slowly hustled his way up from being a "mere bastard" to becoming a protector of Westeros without its people even knowing about or acknowledging the creeping danger that was brewing in the North, serving as a kind of commentary on contemporary society and confirming Jon Snow's role as a tragic hero and an underacknowledged good guy who was going to get his catharsis eventually - or would he?... I mean, I could go on, but the point is: I saw, as any reader could, that George R.R. Martin had set up a beautiful, unpredictable but internally consistent set of story arcs to weave together towards a majestic, intense, and satisfying ending. It became clear that that is a hell of a task, and so I understand why his writing became slower. I knew he wasn't going to mess up the story that is his life's central work. And so, when I heard that the series was going to depart from the books due to lack of source material to adapt, my interest in the series dropped, and my expectations were lowered. Throughout the 8th season, I stopped watching - I just lost interest. You can't just finish someone else's incredibly intricate, long-winded and complex story in a short amount of time in a way that does the story justice.

    Sascha HusenbethSascha Husenbeth5 ngày trước
  • Attack on titan be like: First Time?

    Mukiy GamerMukiy Gamer6 ngày trước
    • Was going to say that same thing. AoT ending is awful. At least with GoT, we could see the quality drop incoming. AoT droppped the ball on the very last 2 chapters.

      Fer VerdusFer Verdus5 ngày trước
  • Couples naming their daughters Khaleesi... 😂😂😂😂😂😂

    DL ButtersDL Butters6 ngày trước
  • Attack on titans>>>>> 😂😂😂🖐🏻

    DalleDalle6 ngày trước
    • Aot is disappointing

      Red MasterRed Master6 ngày trước
  • People have been conditioned by television shows to expect certain things and anything not conforming to that vision they automatically chalk it up to the dustbin. But GoT always laughed at those expectations, it was a bit too late to be this dismayed. This show is about the Starks. The Starks won. BOTH the Targeryans didn't. They didn't get to anime supervillian "punish" the Lion either. I have no problems with any of that. Subconsiously that is the core of all the derangement syndrome, no matter how many "Appeal to the Book" reasoning they try to mask it with.

    MSU 09MSU 096 ngày trước
  • Guy in video: who aside from the on had any good character arcs this season? Me: (precedes to list every other character)

    MoJoe 99MoJoe 996 ngày trước
  • I wouldnt say that G.G Martin is Lazy, maybe he is, but than again its his Book Series, he takes time with it, and i cant blame him for it, its his Creation, i rather have him taking his Time and release a Good Written Book instead of a rushed one, i mean i look at Game of thrones Tv series.

    Bruce DoyleBruce Doyle6 ngày trước
  • Let me tell you how to ruin a great show... You can ruin a great show when you have this certain character, who seems to have a purpose set from season 1 episode 1. That purpose is also the main purpose of the show, and it remains until the end of season 7. And then season 8 comes and the writers say and i quote: Fuck Dany and her wanting the throne, lets make her character not make any sence, then kill her and make a secondary character the actual king. lol.

    Alexandre NabaisAlexandre Nabais6 ngày trước
  • Third comment: Martin didn’t tell them Dany was going that way. Her arc leads her to DYING IN THE NORTH. 👀 You didn’t read the books well after a certain point because of *the best character ever, Daenerys Targaryen,* so you didn’t pick up on all the other clues left for her ending. 😬 Cannot turn a gentle heart evil. You can only make them too angry and given the beast of her House, the Dragons, her anger is destruction. Also didn’t you ever realize she’s based off Khali - the mother Goddess of Rebirth through purging by fire and bringing back life from destruction? Nothing you’ve stated even comes close to something she’d even consider or think. How did she take Yunkai and Meereen? Without much loss on either side. Which innocents died???? 0???? Hold on wait the books said she killed 0 innocents in two cities???? HMMMMMMMMM.

    Qꪊꫀꫀꪀ ᙃꪖꫀꪀꫀɾꪗડ Ʈꪖɾᧁꪖɾꪗꫀꪀ 『ɬꫝꫀ Mꪮɬꫝꫀཞ ꪮᎦ ᙃཞꪖᧁꪮꪀཧ』Qꪊꫀꫀꪀ ᙃꪖꫀꪀꫀɾꪗડ Ʈꪖɾᧁꪖɾꪗꫀꪀ 『ɬꫝꫀ Mꪮɬꫝꫀཞ ꪮᎦ ᙃཞꪖᧁꪮꪀཧ』6 ngày trước
  • Sorry for the separate comment, but: George had said before that he was pausing on TWoW, because he wanted to put out the show(s) (HotD) and companion novellas. So, yeah. The manuscript for the books were given to them and DumbF-k and Dumbass just said “NOPE, more TiTs and CoCk JoKeS!”

    Qꪊꫀꫀꪀ ᙃꪖꫀꪀꫀɾꪗડ Ʈꪖɾᧁꪖɾꪗꫀꪀ 『ɬꫝꫀ Mꪮɬꫝꫀཞ ꪮᎦ ᙃཞꪖᧁꪮꪀཧ』Qꪊꫀꫀꪀ ᙃꪖꫀꪀꫀɾꪗડ Ʈꪖɾᧁꪖɾꪗꫀꪀ 『ɬꫝꫀ Mꪮɬꫝꫀཞ ꪮᎦ ᙃཞꪖᧁꪮꪀཧ』6 ngày trước
  • Kit with the most accurate description. 🤣

    Qꪊꫀꫀꪀ ᙃꪖꫀꪀꫀɾꪗડ Ʈꪖɾᧁꪖɾꪗꫀꪀ 『ɬꫝꫀ Mꪮɬꫝꫀཞ ꪮᎦ ᙃཞꪖᧁꪮꪀཧ』Qꪊꫀꫀꪀ ᙃꪖꫀꪀꫀɾꪗડ Ʈꪖɾᧁꪖɾꪗꫀꪀ 『ɬꫝꫀ Mꪮɬꫝꫀཞ ꪮᎦ ᙃཞꪖᧁꪮꪀཧ』6 ngày trước
  • I was most interested in the show because of Dany. So it was even more of a disappointment to me. Couldn't they let one female character be badass, kind, and a true leader without throwing a twist in the end that makes her an evil witch? 🙄

    Jessica MuellerJessica Mueller6 ngày trước
  • Disappointment of the decade.

    AndreiAndrei6 ngày trước
  • "Everywhere she goes, evil men die and we cheer her for it. And she grows more powerful and more sure that she is good and right. She believes her destiny is to build a better world for everyone. If you believed that... if you truly believed it, wouldn't you kill whoever stood between you and paradise?" Yeah this lede is buried in there in a clumsy and simplified way, but it says more than every smartass comment and every Mad Queen thinkpiece Hollywood Reporter and Buzzfeed wrote. If you're even remotely aware of the backdrop of any modern social revolution, whether French, Russian, Chinese, or any other, you know that those revolutions bathed in the indscriminate murders of thousands and even millions of people, whether justified or not. Revolutionaries are by nature selfless ascetics, unshakable in their belief and convinced that only their ideology could alleviate human suffering and build a "better world", for which ANY sacrifice is permissible. This mentality often leads to intolerant reactionary tendencies when they finally achieve power. Wading through rivers of blood is the one constant of every social revolution because it's the birthing convulsions of the new world out of the shell of the old. The old world will never die in peace. It's hard to convey this historical context to the person on the street, but I appreciate their intent.

    Cheese PuffsCheese Puffs6 ngày trước
  • people complain about Jaime's redemption, as if real people are only good or bad, no gray area, character arcs always have to be linear in progression, and any conflicting duality is incomprehensible (a great example of that duality is Jaime's priorities with Brienne vs his priorities with Edmure in the No One episode). Yeah Jaime burned Cersei's letter in a A Feast For Crows. Doesn't mean he's not going to be drawn back to her later. That's the duality. In the show, him misleading Brienne and going back to the "familiar, abusive relationship" happens all the time in real life. There's literally a syndrome named after it, but funny all the nitpickers seem to ignore a simple emotional psychology and instead get mad there's no color coded #TeamGoodGuy jersey for poor Jaime. Anything a little more complicated than a class-bully-to-Gandhi tropey transformation blows the average viewer's mind. But more importantly, fans overlook the fact that *Jaime's entire arc isn't about becoming a "good guy", it's him redeeming his "kingslayer" legacy, which he does, by becoming the "queen protector"* . *Jaime's character is written from the start as the misunderstood tragic antihero, so it is fitting that he dies exactly like a tragic antihero*. They were always meant to die together. He said "nothing else matters, only us" at the very beginning and he kept that promise in the end. I'm sure viewers would've loved those heroic-revenge-fantasy-Avengers-Assemble reddit theories of Jaime choking out Cersei or Arya becoming faceless Jaime and finally avenging Ned, it would've made for great television that fans could cheer to, it would've also been Disney cringe nonsense. If Jaime really is 'a changed man', what sense does it even make for him to kill his sister at her weakest moment? As for Cersei, what else would you have prefered? Death by dragonfire? Begging and pleading at Dany's feet? That stuff would've made for great television, a real nice Disney good-vs-evil morality play and totally antithetical to what the show has always been. Her dying crushed by the weight of her own dynasty, a dynasty which Tywin said was to last a thousand years, is a way more fitting end for a "Bloody" Mary I type character, very much like a Macbethean ending. The Valonqar did happen, Cersei dies with Jaime's eyes and arms around her, just not the way people thought, and that makes them mad.

    Æthelred the UnreadyÆthelred the Unready6 ngày trước
    • You: All those "fans" were too dumb to appreciate the masterpiece D&D: kInDa FoRgOt

      Adam HeywoodAdam Heywood6 ngày trước
  • Dany's revolutionary zeal mixed with her authoritarianism was ALWAYS meant to be her undoing, there are scenes upon seasons of her advisors keeping her worst impulses in check.The lesson of her story is that " *power without accountability can never truly liberate* ".Jon holding his murdered love only a few feet from her heart's true desire (the throne) is very Hamletesque, there's a "terrible beauty" in it. GRRM would do exactly that, ala Tyrion and Shae. People get so mad that Jaime didn't end up as a #GoodGuy (all character arcs must be simplified, linear cliches. Duality is incomprehensible), but Jaime's entire arc isn't about becoming a good guy, it's him redeeming the kingslayer legacy, which he does, by becoming the queen protector. Jaime's character was always written as the tragic antihero, so it's not 'dumb', that he dies exactly like a tragic antihero. Jaime misleading Brienne and then going back to the 'familiar, abusive relationship' happens all the time in real life, they literally have a syndrome named after it. Not unrealistic, people just had a predictable arc mapped out in their head.Yeah he burned the letter in the book,but he can easily reverse his course later. Anything more complicated than a class-bully-to-Gandhi transformation seem to blow the trope'd out mind. Jon was always a free-folk at heart, his entire arc was about voluntarily giving up power to be a better person, because there are no "Good Tsars". He is the anti-Dany. Nowhere did I pick up GRRM guaranteeing between the lines that a Targeryan HAD to end up on the throne. If anything he would do the exact opposite of the obvious and predictable, because everything he wrote is "hope killing" subversive stuff. And Sansa, the pushover, the afterthought, who always imitated(down to her clothes) the people she admired, surprise...surprise...was the one who ended up learning enough from all the best minds to end up the winner. Sansa's povs have the most depth and qualitatively shits on Dany's. There's a whole bunch of foreshadowing by GRRM on why the very reasons of Cersei and Dany's inevitable downfall were Sansa's strengths. Also GRRM wanted Bran to be the king. The books started with Bran, the first chapter, it had to end with Bran. That's textbook symbolism of the "bard" as the essential element of history. GRRM wrote the name "Bran the Broken".This was a show about the Starks, the Starks were gonna win, not Dany. I'm betting if the final book comes out, the endpoint of none of these characters would be radically different. Most importantly, I'm so glad they didn't do those heroic-revenge-fantasy-Avengers-Assemble reddit theories of Jaime choking out Cersei or Arya becoming faceless Jaime and finally avenging Ned. I'm sure the sheep would love it but it's shallow Disney cringe. If Jaime really is 'a changed man', what sense does it even make for him to kill his sister at her weakest moment. Yes the Valonqar happened, Cersei did die staring at Jaime's eyes and in his hands, just not the way people expected and that makes them mad. He said "nothing else matters, only us" at the very beginning, he kept that promise at the very end. People abhor the pangs of conscience they feel for Tyrion and Jaime instead of being able to mindlessly cheer for a sanitized war (what a heart wrenching scene btw, if that was in the books they would've said it's the greatest thing ever). As for Cersei, what else would you have prefered? Death by dragonfire (YIKES)? Begging and pleading at Dany's feet (CRINGE)? That stuff would've made for great television, but her dying crushed by the weight of her own dynasty, a dynasty which Tywin said was to last a thousand years, is a way more fitting end for a "Bloody" Mary I type character, an unbowed queen, very much like a Macbethean ending. The real mistake the show made was that it got too big to pull off an unfulfilling, poignant tragedy whose main asset is a dark, twisted visual spectacle, when people just want those punch the air "YEAAAAH" moments. Outcome was too similar to the actual anti-climactic ending of the War of the Roses and not enough Troy or Gladiator in it.Big mistake. It's like reading Shakespeare to your dog.

    Æthelred the UnreadyÆthelred the Unready6 ngày trước
  • Just came to reiterate that I love everything about the last 2 episodes. The thematic splendor, the majestic visuals, the poignant Shakesperean tragedy, everything from the Hound and the Mountain in a flaming inferno, to the "terrible beauty" of the wintery throne room with Jon and Dany's melancholic Hamlet-esque ending, to Cersei being crushed by the weight of her empire, to the very weaknesses of Dany and Cersei being Sansa's strength as foreshadowed by GRRM all over the books, I love EVERYTHING. If I were to create a Season 8, I would do it exactly like David and Dan did, not some predictable goofy tropey nonsense revenge fantasy cringe bullshit like Arya wearing Jaime's face (YUCK) to kill Cersei, or Dany dying in childbirth or the Disneyest Disney sappy happy fanfic of them all : the show ending with a Jonerys wedding. That stuff would've made for great television, but Dany's unchecked revolutionary zeal mixed with her authoritarianism was always meant to be her undoing and Cersei being crushed by the weight of her own dynasty is a much fitting Mcbethean end for an proud and unbowed Queen "Bloody" Mary I type character than her begging and grovelling. Jon was always a free-folk at heart, his entire arc was about voluntarily giving up power to be a better person. Because there are no "Good Tsars", he is the anti-Dany. The show from the very beginning has been hammering in the point that it's futile to put your hopes on 'good monarchs' and 'good saviors', as " *power without accountability can never truly liberate* ".If you were watching this for a Targeryan Jon vs Final Boss Night King epic, you Haven't Been Paying Attention. People just needed that #teamgoodguys chopping off some #teambadguys heads and doing cartwheels on top of the throne while they cheer over pizza and wings like a superbowl sunday. People love a sanitized, romanticized war and HATE when they don't have a clearly defined side to root for. I want Stannis to kill Joffrey, but Tyrion to live. Why can't the High Sparrow die but Maergery somehow survive.Love Dany burning the Lannisters but why does Jaime and Bronn have to be there. Why did Robert kill the children. People abhor the pangs of conscience they feel for Tyrion and Jaime instead of being able to mindlessly cheer for a sanitized war (what a heart wrenching scene btw, if that was in the books they would've said it's the greatest thing ever). Those situations of amiguous loyalties that cut through houses and put brothers against brothers (like the War of the Roses,who wuda thunk!) really frustrate fans. Why can't all the good guys be on the same side?!I'm waiting for the Valonqar! It happens, Cersei did die staring at Jaime's eyes,his arms around her neck, just not the way people expected and that makes them mad. 90% of the rage, disappointment didn't happen cause of book plotholes and niche ASOIAF reddit theories like Azor Azoi.Regular viewers don't know or care.To them it all boiled down to Dany or Jon not getting a happy ending. Fans had already written the story in their heads, so when they didn't get the fanservice they're so used to getting, they couldn't believe it. Never seen so many so infuriated by someone doing what they've been doing for 7 seasons: ruthlessly kill those who stood in her way as she believed in "the end justifying the means".The real mistake the show made was that it got too big for its own good to pull off a bittersweet tragedy. Outcome was too similar to the actual anti-climactic ending of the War of the Roses, not enough Troy or Gladiator in it. Big mistake. It's like reading Shakespeare to your dog.

    Æthelred the UnreadyÆthelred the Unready6 ngày trước
    • Damn I don't even know where to begin... Ned Starks death and the red wedding was loved by the fans so I don't understand your argument that fans wanted a happy ending, people weren't mad about a bittersweet ending, they were mad about a badly written one. I don't see how you justify Danys sudden genocidal spree through Kings Landing by "they were standing in her way" no they weren't they had already surrendered. Maybe I should reference Shakespeare 20 times so it seems like I know anything about writing. There is a reason why Tyrion got so dumb in season 7-8, its impossible to write a character smarter than yourself. D&D knew how to edit a book into a tv script but as soon as they were on their own the show went to shit, both when it comes to the quality of the dialogs and the structure of the plot.

      Carl XVI Gustaf BernadotteCarl XVI Gustaf Bernadotte5 ngày trước
  • In the finale People always go "wHy iS nOrThmEn dOiNg dIs". Yep they're Northmen, just like Roose & Ramsay Bolton. Just like Locke, Umber & Karstark. Remember the Brienne "3 quick deaths" scene? They were Stark men too. Love people being fake shocked that during war all sides commit atrocities. The army of heroic saints vs evil final bosses only exist in a FPS, real life it's all carpet bombings & chemical weapons. Yeah the last episode is cringe central with the Varys/Euron/Missandei cornball stuff, but so is people managing to act surprised seeing the Dothraki pillaging lmao. Cringe is also being mad that dUh gOoD gUys didn't get the chance to heroically vanquish duH eViL qUeEn Cersei & give you a satisfying end. GOOD. That's the point. *Real wars rarerly have satisfying endings* . Why couldn't she just burn the Red Keep! Just kill Cersei! I mean if only we could just kill Saddam & leave lmao. The reality is Dany was always gonna go off the rails without Jorah or Barristan to counsel her. This wasn't Dragon Lady Bad Overnight, there's about 15 different episodes of her counsels begging & pleading her not to commit mass slaughter, a whole bunch of premonitions in the books. If that wasn't hint enough all there was left to do was to knock the self-denial out of the viewer with a frying pan. GoT has always been about nihilism, not knights in shining armors. Good, nothing worse than a desensitized war. If only Jaime lined up with dUh gOoD gUys, then you won't have to worry about cheering for mass murder. Cersei not having an anime supervillian death is the best thing they did. Jaime dying with his eyes & arms around Cersei IS the character arc that he promised in one of the very first episodes when he said "nothing else matters, until you & I are the only ones left". It chaps the viewer's ass because this is the one Valonqar scene they couldn't predict. Plus casuals never cared for book loopholes.The real gut punch was not getting a happily ever after, they couldn't believe the show would have the audacity to make them feel stupid for putting all their faiths on demagogic "liberators". Not being able to enjoy NPC mass slaughter as they're forced to feel bad for the likes of Jaime. It's almost like they took that "if you thought this has a happy ending you haven't been paying attention" philosophy seriously when they added it in Ramsay's dialogue.

    Cheese PuffsCheese Puffs6 ngày trước
  • Can we please kill this fucking "wanting justice for the atrocities committed against you" is "petty" shit? It's not fucking petty to want vengeance against Neanderthals who slaughtered your entire family. If anything that's the least subversive trope. In almost all revenge films, the person committing the vengeance is almost always told to be wrong in the end by virtue of actually demanding justice. And it almost never explores deeper than the idea that vengeance=bad... because apparently it just is? So many shows and movies that speak out against vengeance come to mind, law abiding citizen chief among them, and I feel that is the most used trope in revenge stories. That "you lose yourself along the way" and other fucking bullshit that the west just up and decided was a universal truth. There are movies where the guy or girl gets their revenge, and there's nothing "petty" about it. Humans have a built in need for justice, and revenge and justice are quite literally conceptually the exact same thing poured through different strainers. Objectively, revenge *can* be justice and justice *can* be a form of revenge. Objectively speaking it _is_ a form of revenge, merely the vengeance of a collective. They are not mutually exclusive. This idea that "justice" is wholesome compared to dirty vengeance is childish. It completely disregards all the evil done within the "justice" system. The loopholes and miscarriages of justice it creates. Our very concept of justice only being justice when voted in by a separate group of people is inherently flawed because people are inherently flawed. And it's why with 12 jurors so much evil has still managed to happen under the jurisdiction of our justice system. I ask for an actually mature discussion about revenge. Not just parroting the west's made up moral value that states justice is always superior to vengeance, as though they are two different things entirely.

    Richard McCreadyRichard McCready6 ngày trước
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